How Patrick Brammall Dads - An atypical path to dadding, and all the typical ups and downs!

[00:00:00] Support for How Other Dads Dad comes from Hertz Rent-A-Car. We like to think that here at How Other Dads Dad we might inspire you to maybe take a little trip, take a little adventure or do something you wouldn't have otherwise done before hearing these conversations and you know what if that involves renting a car then boy oh boy do you know how to talk to the good people at Hertz. Go to youherz.com.au forward slash h-o-d-d you can get 25% off the day rate there that's a little special.

[00:00:30] bonus for How Other Dads Dad listeners terms and conditions apply to that. If your adventure doesn't involve renting a car then you know still just keep listening anyway and I don't think it hurts a mind about that either. Regardless it's a bloody good offer and we thank you Hertz. Let's get on with that episode.

[00:01:01] How Other Dads Dads Dads

[00:01:33] I'm trying to make it up as we go along as I know a lot of us are. Today extremely lucky to have Aussie writer, actor, creator of many funny things Patrick Bramall, Big Paddy Bramall as I don't refer to him. I don't think anyone refers to me as Big Paddy Bramall. He's not a small guy. I am taller. I'm not trying to... This isn't why I had him on to height shame him. He's a great average height Paddy. But he's a legend. He's... and for people that are familiar with Colin from Accounts genuinely you know one of

[00:02:03] if not the funniest creation comedically to come out of this country in a very long time. Huge international hit. He's responsible for many other things. He creates the show with his partner Harriet. They have as you're about to hear. They have an adopted child. And he is relatively new on the...

[00:02:22] into the journey of being a dad only a couple years in. But as you'll also hear and what we love Patrick for like of course his ability to observe himself, observe humans, to analyze it. We... you know we're very used to him putting it into... turning that into comedic material but that's where it comes from. He's got an amazing mind for those observations. And you know that's why I wanted to chat to him. He did not disappoint.

[00:02:47] It was... it was a lot of fun sitting down figuring out how Patrick Bramall dads.

[00:03:00] Paddy Bramall, welcome to the couch. Thanks. It's so nice to be on this leather couch. Thank you. With this real sheepskin? Yeah, look it could be. It's 2024 guys. What are you doing with real sheepskin? No, no that's mammoth skin.

[00:03:15] Better. Old. We found it frozen. Great. It was already here. This is actually...

[00:03:18] and this is a bizarre segue but that sheepskin like that... I actually have never really thought about this too much but we come here and we talk about fatherhood and stuff.

[00:03:26] And that's like the couch where we... I've had our babies and... Really?

[00:03:30] I didn't have a home birth. I thought it smelled funny.

[00:03:34] This is the couch I gave birth on. That's why the sheepskin's so cross-toothed.

[00:03:37] Yes, that makes sense. But it's definitely...

[00:03:38] It's a bit hard. That's the rug that all the kids were like you know...

[00:03:40] Really?

[00:03:48] Yeah. We can't lose that couch. I love that couch.

[00:03:50] So this is your pick? This couch?

[00:03:52] This literally was the only piece of furniture in our whole relationship...

[00:03:55] And it's out.

[00:03:55] ...I've had any influence over.

[00:03:57] And it's out but I've hung on and now it's here.

[00:03:59] Well, look. It's not a bad view here.

[00:04:02] Mate. Well, the reason you are here...

[00:04:04] Yes.

[00:04:04] And this is... I hope this doesn't sound narcissistic but at the Logies you sort of came up and were like,

[00:04:10] Hey, I listened to the show which I was blown away by that you would have heard it and listened to it because I'm a very big fan of yours.

[00:04:17] Stop it.

[00:04:18] And so I was like, well, we don't say this to everyone that says I listen to the show but would you come on?

[00:04:23] Would you come and talk about being a dad?

[00:04:24] Because I know you are pretty fresh into the dad game.

[00:04:27] I'm fresh. I'm fresh.

[00:04:29] So I feel... I wouldn't say fraudulent being here but I've listened to both seasons.

[00:04:34] Not every episode but much of.

[00:04:37] And obviously I skipped the Tim Minchin one because what a dick.

[00:04:40] He's not going to listen to this, is he? That's a wasted joke.

[00:04:43] I mean, I'll send it to him now but yeah.

[00:04:45] Yeah, just send him the clip and I... What was I saying?

[00:04:48] You are fresh to being a dad.

[00:04:49] Oh, yeah, yeah. Not fraudulent but I listen to so many dads and there's so much wisdom in these chats that you've had that I'm like,

[00:04:57] I know nothing. Like I really don't know much at all.

[00:05:00] Like my daughter's two and a half and I feel like...

[00:05:04] Like we can talk about my philosophy as a dad and all that sort of stuff

[00:05:08] but I just realise how young I am as a dad.

[00:05:12] Well, I think we all...

[00:05:13] But I think it's a good place to start because we all...

[00:05:17] I still... I feel fraudulent too because my kids are nine and six.

[00:05:20] So anytime we get anyone on...

[00:05:22] Yeah, outranked.

[00:05:24] Immediately.

[00:05:25] It's just like, what do I know?

[00:05:26] Like, you know, I've got kids who are still write cute cards and slide them under the door and...

[00:05:32] Really?

[00:05:32] That makes it sound like I don't let my kids see me.

[00:05:35] And you keep the door locked at all times.

[00:05:37] In reference to...

[00:05:38] I actually had food poisoning yesterday.

[00:05:40] I was hiding away in the spare room.

[00:05:41] But, you know, they still do cute kid stuff.

[00:05:43] And then that's why I love this show because, you know, there are people on that have like been through it.

[00:05:48] Yeah.

[00:05:49] But it doesn't take anything away from the fact that I think so many guys at the start of the journey are...

[00:05:54] We all feel pretty fraudulent.

[00:05:56] Like, it's just sort of like ready, set, boom.

[00:05:58] You have a kid.

[00:05:59] I mean, what drew you to wanting to be a dad?

[00:06:03] I mean, you've come to fatherhood not late in life but later.

[00:06:06] Late.

[00:06:07] Late 40s.

[00:06:08] Yeah.

[00:06:08] I'm 47 now.

[00:06:09] It's not outrageous but it's not...

[00:06:11] It's not...

[00:06:11] It's not helpful for playing on the floor.

[00:06:13] You know what I mean?

[00:06:13] It's...

[00:06:14] I was...

[00:06:14] Well, she's...

[00:06:15] I'm 47 now.

[00:06:17] I was 45.

[00:06:18] Yeah, right.

[00:06:19] Was it always something you wanted to do or what?

[00:06:20] It is something I've always wanted to do but I couldn't have...

[00:06:22] I couldn't...

[00:06:23] I can't have kids naturally.

[00:06:24] Okay.

[00:06:25] Because I was a really sick kid myself and that was...

[00:06:27] And one of the legacies of that is I've always known I wouldn't be able to make my own,

[00:06:32] you know, in the kitchen by myself.

[00:06:34] Well, obviously you can't do it by yourself.

[00:06:36] You need a...

[00:06:36] But you do need a kitchen.

[00:06:38] And so I always knew I'd have to do something like the IVF or something like that and my wife

[00:06:43] Harry and I were in...

[00:06:44] We live in the US and over there adoption is a real thing.

[00:06:48] It's a really difficult thing to do here.

[00:06:50] And I know there are advocates here who are trying to, you know, make it work.

[00:06:54] But anyway, in the US it's an option that's very available.

[00:06:58] So we were living there and it was COVID and we were bored so we thought, hey, let's adopt

[00:07:03] the...

[00:07:05] We thought now's the time, you know, we were at the right...

[00:07:08] It was just the right time in our relationship and stuff to do it.

[00:07:11] And I was like, here we go.

[00:07:12] Let's give it a shot.

[00:07:13] On one hand, a lot of couples go through that conversation just deciding to have a kid.

[00:07:19] Yeah.

[00:07:19] But it's just a different avenue, I suppose.

[00:07:21] Yeah.

[00:07:21] It's not the same as let's try and conceive.

[00:07:23] Like, is that...

[00:07:24] What's the timeline like on adopting?

[00:07:26] It was...

[00:07:26] I mean, it varies wildly.

[00:07:28] But for us it was roughly nine or ten months.

[00:07:31] Okay.

[00:07:32] So it's about the same time for you to mentally get your head around it.

[00:07:35] Yeah.

[00:07:35] Harry says we're pregnant with paperwork, which isn't...

[00:07:38] You don't have the same physical discomfort, but there is discomfort involved.

[00:07:43] Exactly.

[00:07:43] So it's about the same time to get your head wrapped around it, except there's no physical

[00:07:47] change.

[00:07:47] So it's really something that's in your head.

[00:07:51] It's a strange thing to process.

[00:07:53] Can you remember the weirdest stuff you have to fill out in the paperwork?

[00:07:56] Like, is there any way they can cut that down or is it all...

[00:07:57] Oh, dude.

[00:07:58] It was...

[00:07:59] It's a full exam.

[00:08:00] It's a full financial, legal, are you good people?

[00:08:04] Are you safe people?

[00:08:05] Like, it's all stuff that should be in place.

[00:08:07] Which is...

[00:08:08] But it is slightly odd, isn't it?

[00:08:09] Because people that are just biologically having children don't get that.

[00:08:13] You guys didn't have to do that.

[00:08:14] We did not.

[00:08:15] No.

[00:08:15] Thank God.

[00:08:16] I'm probably more qualified than you guys are.

[00:08:18] Yeah.

[00:08:18] Legally.

[00:08:19] Like in the eyes of the government.

[00:08:20] Yeah.

[00:08:20] Asked a lot of checks.

[00:08:22] Yeah.

[00:08:22] All right.

[00:08:23] And then, boom, she's in your life.

[00:08:25] Yeah.

[00:08:25] She's there.

[00:08:26] Yeah.

[00:08:26] And then it is like...

[00:08:28] And then it's on.

[00:08:29] And then it's like that you say three, two, one, off you go.

[00:08:31] It's like, shit, I'm a dad.

[00:08:33] What does that mean?

[00:08:34] Oh, wow.

[00:08:35] And that's why I mean...

[00:08:36] Like, I'm learning all the time, every day.

[00:08:39] Literally.

[00:08:40] You know how people say, like, it's the hardest thing I've ever done?

[00:08:41] And I've heard you say it on this podcast.

[00:08:43] It's the hardest thing I've ever done.

[00:08:44] That doesn't even begin to cover it.

[00:08:47] You know what I mean?

[00:08:48] It's not even a thing.

[00:08:48] This is...

[00:08:49] Being a dad, a parent, isn't even a thing.

[00:08:50] No, you're right.

[00:08:51] Because saying it's a thing you've done makes it sound like a fun run or a...

[00:08:55] Yeah.

[00:08:56] Or a task or a...

[00:09:02] Exactly.

[00:09:03] It's a fundamental...

[00:09:05] It becomes the water you swim in.

[00:09:06] Totally.

[00:09:07] Yeah.

[00:09:07] It becomes a different...

[00:09:08] Your life...

[00:09:09] There's like a line through my life.

[00:09:11] And that...

[00:09:12] Before that line, the baseline was my time was my own.

[00:09:17] You know, ultimately.

[00:09:18] It was up to me.

[00:09:19] And now it'll never be that way again.

[00:09:21] And I think there'll be people listening to this that don't have kids yet.

[00:09:24] I know, like, a lot of...

[00:09:26] From just anecdotal evidence on the street, guys that listen to this podcast,

[00:09:29] some of them are thinking about having kids and they don't have kids.

[00:09:32] They hear a sentence like that and they're sort of like, oh, that's...

[00:09:37] For someone that has an experience, that's a scary concept.

[00:09:40] Yeah.

[00:09:40] It's hard to convey the upside.

[00:09:42] Yeah.

[00:09:42] And it's easy to convey the downside.

[00:09:44] Yeah.

[00:09:45] But how do you convey the upside?

[00:09:48] I don't.

[00:09:49] I don't...

[00:09:50] I feel like it's not my job to convey the upside.

[00:09:53] It just is.

[00:09:54] Like, it's my life.

[00:09:55] Yeah.

[00:09:56] So...

[00:09:56] And it's like love.

[00:09:58] You know, it's different for everybody.

[00:10:00] It's...

[00:10:01] And I'm not trying to undersell it or I'm not...

[00:10:03] It's like fatherhood or love or any of those kind of nebulous concepts.

[00:10:11] It's like it becomes a part of you and it's a reflection of the edges of you

[00:10:17] and the insides of you and you learn shit about yourself and it's uncomfortable

[00:10:20] and it's also extremely joyous.

[00:10:23] Like, I would not recommend to someone who was like,

[00:10:26] I don't know if I want to be a parent.

[00:10:27] I wouldn't say you must.

[00:10:29] Yeah.

[00:10:30] Like, there's real value in not doing it as well.

[00:10:32] I wouldn't say parenthood...

[00:10:34] I'm just not one of those people.

[00:10:35] It hasn't been my experience that it has completed me as a person.

[00:10:40] And I've spoken to other dads, biological dads,

[00:10:42] who have said a similar thing and it's...

[00:10:45] But on the other hand...

[00:10:47] Which I don't think is...

[00:10:48] I think that's good.

[00:10:49] Yeah, it shouldn't need to complete someone as a person.

[00:10:52] No, but I think there is a sort of a way of saying it,

[00:10:56] which is it's an evolutionary urge, you know,

[00:10:59] from an evolutionary perspective.

[00:11:00] It is the completion.

[00:11:01] You know, you're finally fulfilling your evolutionary...

[00:11:04] I've made another one.

[00:11:06] I've made another one.

[00:11:06] I can check out now.

[00:11:07] I'm done.

[00:11:07] I'm out.

[00:11:08] Yeah, yeah.

[00:11:08] I've made one.

[00:11:09] Now I can relax.

[00:11:09] I'm not going to leave the world down a headcount.

[00:11:11] Yeah, yeah.

[00:11:13] But I think now that I am a father, it's...

[00:11:17] I wouldn't unwish that ever.

[00:11:19] Like, I...

[00:11:20] It's...

[00:11:21] That's what I mean.

[00:11:21] Like, it's not even...

[00:11:22] It's...

[00:11:23] It becomes...

[00:11:24] It is my life.

[00:11:25] Yeah.

[00:11:26] You know, it's a strange thing.

[00:11:26] I can't even get my head around it because I can't articulate it properly.

[00:11:29] Well, I think...

[00:11:29] Yeah, I think...

[00:11:30] Yeah, you're right.

[00:11:31] It changes you too because...

[00:11:32] And we all change all the time.

[00:11:34] Yeah.

[00:11:34] It just becomes the most powerful thing that's ever changed you.

[00:11:36] Absolutely.

[00:11:37] Easily.

[00:11:38] What are your three...

[00:11:39] I mean, I gave you the homework.

[00:11:41] Yeah.

[00:11:41] You've heard the show.

[00:11:42] What are your three fathering words, philosophies?

[00:11:47] Location, location, location.

[00:11:48] No, no, it's...

[00:11:49] I think...

[00:11:50] And like I said, I think this would change over time.

[00:11:52] But for me, for now, it's like...

[00:11:54] It would be engagement, which I've heard Dad say on this thing.

[00:12:00] But it's really true.

[00:12:02] Just engagement or attention.

[00:12:04] Yeah.

[00:12:05] And patience and boundaries.

[00:12:08] Those are my three at the moment.

[00:12:10] That's awesome.

[00:12:10] Yeah.

[00:12:11] Yeah.

[00:12:12] None of them are particularly sexy, but I guess I'm not here to be...

[00:12:16] I mean, it's a nice couch, but...

[00:12:17] Yeah.

[00:12:18] Well, I mean, we give everyone a sexiness rating at the end.

[00:12:21] Totally, totally, totally.

[00:12:22] You've got time to bring it back.

[00:12:23] Great.

[00:12:24] With engagement, because you're at that time of your daughter's life, she's two and a half.

[00:12:29] Yes, you're fresh to it, but you're not that...

[00:12:30] Like, you've had years of experience now.

[00:12:32] So, you're in...

[00:12:33] You're certainly in that zone where you're like, I know what I stand for and I know what

[00:12:36] I want the absolute bedrock to be of our relationship.

[00:12:40] Yeah.

[00:12:40] And is that where the engagement piece comes in for you?

[00:12:44] The engagement piece, it's just a daily thing.

[00:12:47] It's just being...

[00:12:48] It's just knowing that she needs attention.

[00:12:52] Like, she needs air and light and food and drink, you know?

[00:12:57] She just needs it.

[00:12:58] And she needs it from us because we're her parents, you know?

[00:13:01] But the flip of that is we're so fucking busy all the time.

[00:13:05] I was going to say, you guys are phenomenally busy.

[00:13:07] We're so busy and we have childcare, you know?

[00:13:12] We have childcare and we have a nanny while we're in Australia at the moment because we're

[00:13:14] making a show.

[00:13:16] And it's...

[00:13:16] We need it.

[00:13:17] It's necessary.

[00:13:18] And so, we're very conscious about around those times when we can be there, actually being

[00:13:25] there.

[00:13:26] Because there's such a difference when she hasn't been with us for a couple of days or

[00:13:31] like we've had a trip and we just haven't seen much over a couple of days or something

[00:13:34] like that.

[00:13:35] You can see the difference in her and you can feel the difference when we've spent

[00:13:39] a weekend together.

[00:13:41] It's so obvious and it's really simple.

[00:13:43] I know.

[00:13:44] And it really is just...

[00:13:45] It doesn't have to be anything more than that, you realise.

[00:13:48] Like, it's just the being.

[00:13:49] I think we bring a lot of stuff to it as parents or dads.

[00:13:52] We're like, all right, like, it's going to be like a razzle-dazzle day.

[00:13:55] Yeah.

[00:13:56] Or whatever.

[00:13:56] Yeah.

[00:13:57] So often when I catch myself in one of those modes of like, hey, I've planned five things

[00:14:01] and your head's kind of distracted with logistics, you just realise if we were just hanging out

[00:14:07] on the couch all day and then we washed the car outside, like, that would have been just

[00:14:12] as great a day.

[00:14:13] Yeah, yeah.

[00:14:14] Well, so many stories I've heard are like, got this big thing and the kid remembers,

[00:14:17] you know, the car ride or the food, the thing they got on the food they got on the plane

[00:14:21] or something.

[00:14:21] It's like, they don't remember the trip to Tokyo or anything like that.

[00:14:23] No, I mean, our one is always, like, candy, unfortunately, is a huge factor in my daughter's

[00:14:28] life.

[00:14:29] Great.

[00:14:29] And we did this big, like, family bike ride in New Zealand over, like, New Year's, this

[00:14:34] one just gone.

[00:14:36] And, yeah, getting to make your own, like, trail mix.

[00:14:39] That was, like, Rudy's.

[00:14:40] Making your own trail mix.

[00:14:41] Just having, like, bags full of Scroggen.

[00:14:44] Like, it's a big thing for her.

[00:14:47] I get it.

[00:14:47] She remembers the Scroggen.

[00:14:48] I get it.

[00:14:49] Which essentially is a show bag, which essentially is us just going to the supermarket and going,

[00:14:54] like, I think it was just the freedom of just picking any candy.

[00:14:57] Yeah.

[00:14:57] Like, she was just like, this is blowing my mind.

[00:14:59] Yeah.

[00:14:59] I can't believe I can choose what goes in my Scroggen bag.

[00:15:01] It's a huge relief, though.

[00:15:02] Like, it's actually, it's a great thing.

[00:15:04] It's a simple thing.

[00:15:04] You go, what a relief.

[00:15:05] I don't have to do calisthenics to impress my kid or come up with a type of five or just

[00:15:10] some M&Ms, just some sugar, straight up.

[00:15:12] Then we spent the whole time going, please eat some of the banana chips, which aren't any

[00:15:16] healthier.

[00:15:16] Yeah.

[00:15:16] But I was like, just for me.

[00:15:18] But they seem to be because they're banana.

[00:15:19] Just for me.

[00:15:20] Yeah.

[00:15:21] Please don't just eat gummy bears and M&Ms.

[00:15:23] Have some of the nuts.

[00:15:25] The impact of sugar is unbelievable.

[00:15:28] It's like, it's like.

[00:15:29] You'd just be coming into that now, right?

[00:15:30] Yes.

[00:15:31] Yeah.

[00:15:31] She has some and she's jumping up and down and she's like, it's crack.

[00:15:35] It's, I assume.

[00:15:36] I mean, I've never had crack, but I assume this is crack.

[00:15:40] I think you're allowed to be angry at your dealer if they do just give you sugar.

[00:15:43] But yes, it does.

[00:15:44] Yeah.

[00:15:44] Yeah.

[00:15:45] I mean, the fire up is, it's, it's real, isn't it?

[00:15:47] Yeah.

[00:15:48] And you, I have all those flashbacks of like when I was a kid and my mom was like, don't

[00:15:51] give him like, you know, no coke.

[00:15:53] I was like, what are you talking about?

[00:15:54] Like, come on.

[00:15:55] I can handle this.

[00:15:56] I'm normal.

[00:15:56] I'm normal.

[00:15:56] Why?

[00:15:57] And I'm like.

[00:15:58] It's fine.

[00:15:59] It really.

[00:15:59] Yeah.

[00:16:00] Yeah.

[00:16:00] I mean, the horse has bolted unfortunately with my daughter.

[00:16:03] I have now got, man, I got to reel it back in.

[00:16:05] Yeah.

[00:16:05] You can't stuff that.

[00:16:06] But she's an amazing negotiator too.

[00:16:07] So like too many precedents have been set.

[00:16:09] Really?

[00:16:15] Where I've gone, all right, it's a special day.

[00:16:17] Yeah.

[00:16:17] And then that becomes the norm.

[00:16:19] It's Tuesday.

[00:16:20] Yeah.

[00:16:21] Like, you know, my car is now expected to be like an Uber, like, like a premium Uber.

[00:16:25] Like, dad, have you got any mints?

[00:16:27] Do you have any lifesavers?

[00:16:28] What have I done?

[00:16:29] Dad, is this a comfort Uber or what?

[00:16:30] What have I done?

[00:16:31] Yeah.

[00:16:32] She, if it was up to her, she would just put conversation.

[00:16:34] No.

[00:16:34] What have you done?

[00:16:35] Because your daughter is your younger kid, yeah?

[00:16:37] Yeah.

[00:16:37] So you knew.

[00:16:38] I knew.

[00:16:39] And my boy, Sonny just doesn't really care too much about that stuff.

[00:16:42] Oh, okay.

[00:16:43] So you thought, she's not going to care too much.

[00:16:45] I'm not sure if I've mentioned this, but did I tell you, Timmy, this,

[00:16:47] like the negotiation, sorry if this is a double up of a story,

[00:16:51] but like literally I remember being on this bike trip.

[00:16:54] She's got this whole bag full of stuff and I'm like, please, Ru,

[00:16:57] I understand you've got candy and it's very exciting.

[00:17:00] Just eat a nut, like one nut.

[00:17:01] I want to see you eat one nut just to make it feel like you had a mix of,

[00:17:06] because she's just picking all the gummy bears out.

[00:17:08] And then I can be a good dad.

[00:17:09] If you do that, I'm a good dad.

[00:17:10] Just something, because I was like, or a pretzel.

[00:17:12] I don't like pretzels.

[00:17:12] All right.

[00:17:13] Please eat a nut.

[00:17:14] Yeah.

[00:17:15] She's like, I don't really like the nuts in there.

[00:17:18] I'm like, please, Ru.

[00:17:19] She goes, okay, I'll eat a peanut M&M.

[00:17:23] That's amazing.

[00:17:24] In my brain I go, deal.

[00:17:26] Yeah.

[00:17:27] She puts it, that hand in, eats it and then goes, it's like, oh, sorry.

[00:17:33] It was a crispy.

[00:17:35] Because they look the same.

[00:17:37] The crispy M&Ms, the peanut M&Ms.

[00:17:38] I was like, well, we tried.

[00:17:40] Yeah.

[00:17:41] And that's, so that's about.

[00:17:42] She didn't go in again for another one.

[00:17:43] No.

[00:17:43] And that's like where I'm at with the negotiator.

[00:17:45] That's how good she is.

[00:17:47] That's amazing.

[00:17:47] Like, that's how bad my deals get to be with Rudy.

[00:17:51] You're in trouble.

[00:17:52] You're in big trouble.

[00:17:53] Whereas other parents, I'm seeing them like, oh no, we haven't given them sugar.

[00:17:57] Not till they're tan.

[00:17:57] Like we have steamed pumpkin on our bike.

[00:18:00] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:18:01] Seam pumpkin is the best.

[00:18:02] I heard of a parent years ago, a friend of mine who was like, she didn't want her kid

[00:18:06] to have any sugar.

[00:18:07] But some friend, auntie, gave her a snake.

[00:18:10] And then she showed him, look, mom.

[00:18:12] And she went, oh, great.

[00:18:13] You've got that.

[00:18:14] We can bury it in the backyard.

[00:18:15] And she was, great, great.

[00:18:16] And redirected the kid.

[00:18:17] And the kid got excited about burying the snake.

[00:18:20] Under what premise?

[00:18:21] Like to grow.

[00:18:22] Under this is what you do with those.

[00:18:24] Jeez, that's good.

[00:18:25] I mean, you know, that's pretty impressive.

[00:18:27] Yeah, I'm miles off that.

[00:18:28] I don't think the kid's doing well now.

[00:18:31] Well, I mean, my wife.

[00:18:32] But then there's the other argument.

[00:18:35] This is based on no fact.

[00:18:36] But it's like if you like restrict it too much, then the kids go wild.

[00:18:40] Oh, the truth will out.

[00:18:41] That happened to me too.

[00:18:42] Like I remember it being like we were a no, like pretty hard to get your hands on sugar

[00:18:46] in our house.

[00:18:47] Like no chocolate, no sweet biscuits or anything like that.

[00:18:50] That was tough.

[00:18:51] Yeah.

[00:18:51] But then you get to teenage years and when you have like a job and money, that's all

[00:18:56] I was buying.

[00:18:56] Like I was just going.

[00:18:58] So it's somewhere in the middle there.

[00:18:59] So it's somewhere in the middle.

[00:18:59] But we've held off with iPads for like Joanie so far.

[00:19:04] To two and a half?

[00:19:05] It's two and a half.

[00:19:06] And for a while, because we do the long haul a lot between Australia.

[00:19:10] We held off until air travel came into the picture.

[00:19:12] So it's all about, it's connected to air travel now.

[00:19:14] So she knows she only gets it.

[00:19:16] She calls it her phone that she only gets it in the plane.

[00:19:19] So she'll see a plane fly overhead and go, my phone, my phone.

[00:19:22] And she thinks it's probably just one plane flying around with her phone in it.

[00:19:26] Land.

[00:19:27] Land, please.

[00:19:29] Just chuck it out.

[00:19:30] Yeah.

[00:19:30] That's awesome.

[00:19:31] Well, it's gold because it helps with the travel and it means she-

[00:19:35] And it means on the way to the airport, you'd be like, oh, we're going to see the phone soon.

[00:19:38] We're going to see the phone.

[00:19:39] And she gets all cheered up about it.

[00:19:40] Isn't that amazing though how addictive they are?

[00:19:43] They're worse than sugar.

[00:19:44] She's thinking about it.

[00:19:45] Yeah.

[00:19:46] Like she can't wait till the next phone day.

[00:19:48] What have you done?

[00:19:50] What's that?

[00:19:50] With the devices.

[00:19:53] Again, there's some unwinding that's going on now.

[00:19:55] I think Zona are in that critical stage here when you've got that sort of six to nine-year-old.

[00:20:00] You've like done the kid stuff.

[00:20:01] Then you're like, all right, they're getting a bit bigger.

[00:20:03] You loosen the reins a little bit.

[00:20:05] But then you have a moment where you're like, no, we've loosened it too much.

[00:20:10] Here's the thing.

[00:20:11] So again, this is really specific probably to like five to 10-year-olds.

[00:20:14] But the games on iPads are shit, right?

[00:20:17] The games can be shit.

[00:20:19] Yes.

[00:20:19] Especially for young kids like preteen.

[00:20:22] Just low-grade, like repeat dopamine hit.

[00:20:25] Yeah.

[00:20:25] So they're engaging, but they're shit out.

[00:20:26] They're engaging, but they're shit out.

[00:20:27] And they're always encouraging kids to buy stuff, like get packs, get streaks.

[00:20:31] Like it's all just encouraging addictive behavior.

[00:20:34] Yeah.

[00:20:34] So we had a thing where we were like, we'd just let it kind of happen a bit too much.

[00:20:38] But then had one of those like bad suddenly like, that's it, like no gaming on the weekend.

[00:20:44] But it's like, what?

[00:20:45] And then it was like, okay, no iPad gaming on the weekend.

[00:20:48] Then PS5, maybe.

[00:20:49] I'm like, oh my God, this sucks.

[00:20:51] So many caveats.

[00:20:52] This is so convoluted.

[00:20:55] This law is wide open to interpretation.

[00:20:59] And they can smell that a mile off.

[00:21:00] They can smell it.

[00:21:01] And of course, that's terrible parenting for us because like one of the things I think

[00:21:06] it's a parent's job to do is like to your third point is to go, here's the expectation.

[00:21:11] Like here's the boundary.

[00:21:12] Yeah.

[00:21:12] And I think one thing that really messes with the kids' minds, we've had this before on

[00:21:15] the show.

[00:21:16] I think it was Rack that was saying it.

[00:21:17] It's like, you can't change the boundaries for kids.

[00:21:21] You can't mess with their expectations.

[00:21:23] How good was Rack?

[00:21:24] Yeah.

[00:21:24] Jesus.

[00:21:25] I mean, what a powerhouse.

[00:21:26] But it's so true.

[00:21:27] He came into my head first thing as soon as we were like making an absolute mess of this.

[00:21:33] But basically what we wanted to say was, we hate iPad games.

[00:21:36] Yeah.

[00:21:36] They're shit.

[00:21:37] And I think they're deliberately trying to get you addicted to stuff.

[00:21:39] Yes, they are.

[00:21:40] But we understand you like gaming and that's okay.

[00:21:43] Like that's a fun thing to do with your allocated half an hour or whatever.

[00:21:48] We just handled it poorly.

[00:21:49] But that's kind of where we're at.

[00:21:52] So again, you fall into this trap of being like, it's the game version of Please Eat a

[00:21:56] Peanut M&M.

[00:21:56] Yeah.

[00:21:57] For you with boundaries being one of your keywords, what does that mean to you?

[00:22:03] Boundaries at the moment means for me things she can rely on like routines, like bath time

[00:22:11] and bedtime and like simple shit.

[00:22:14] But I mean, I don't know.

[00:22:16] Because she's not, I mean, I don't know.

[00:22:17] And if you have like five kids, maybe by the end you're like, who gives a shit?

[00:22:20] Like I was a third kid.

[00:22:22] Tim, you have four kids.

[00:22:23] Do you?

[00:22:23] Yeah.

[00:22:24] Do you, who gives a shit?

[00:22:25] Not every day.

[00:22:28] Yeah.

[00:22:29] But no, I, all kids I think benefit from routine because they like their pattern, like

[00:22:35] humans are pattern recognition machines.

[00:22:36] Yeah.

[00:22:37] I've seen you with all four.

[00:22:38] Oh, I've seen you with all three, like who can vaguely follow orders.

[00:22:43] Yeah.

[00:22:44] And they're not driven, but they're like, it's like guys were doing this now and they all

[00:22:47] have their night time stories, hair.

[00:22:50] Yeah.

[00:22:50] Yeah.

[00:22:51] Well, obviously it's helpful to you, but there's no doubt that, that it's, it's better for everybody

[00:22:56] when there's a routine there and there's things.

[00:22:58] But I found with Joni, she's so fucking smart.

[00:23:03] I'm sure all, actually I don't know.

[00:23:05] I'm not sure.

[00:23:06] But, but she's so smart.

[00:23:07] She's like a velociraptor.

[00:23:08] Like she'll smell the weakness in the fence and she will every time exploit that weakness.

[00:23:14] And so you think you have one kid, but you've actually got two or three hiding in the bushes

[00:23:17] near you who are ready to attack you.

[00:23:19] Clever girl.

[00:23:20] Yeah.

[00:23:21] And the other one comes out.

[00:23:22] Yeah.

[00:23:23] So she can, so if the routine's not solid or there's a bit of wiggle room.

[00:23:28] Well, she's, she's pretty good at doing, she's good.

[00:23:33] She's getting really good at doing moves, like pulling moves, like crying, but it's a slightly

[00:23:37] different.

[00:23:37] You can tell it's, it's the way her lip goes or something.

[00:23:40] I go, this is a move.

[00:23:42] She's doing this because she knows it'll get a response.

[00:23:44] This is tricky.

[00:23:45] And so it's super tricky because it's, it's all trial and error.

[00:23:48] Um, so for a while I'll be like, oh, she's crying or whatever.

[00:23:50] I've got to respond to it.

[00:23:51] Like it's a real thing.

[00:23:52] Hang on.

[00:23:52] I don't think this is a real thing.

[00:23:53] And then, and then, so that's part of boundaries as well.

[00:23:56] It's like.

[00:23:57] But then there's no panic of going, what if it is real?

[00:23:59] And I responded to her saying, I don't believe you.

[00:24:01] Yep.

[00:24:02] Yep.

[00:24:02] Absolutely.

[00:24:03] Yep.

[00:24:03] At the end of the day, you just got to back your decisions and know you're going to fuck

[00:24:07] it up a lot.

[00:24:07] But that's true.

[00:24:08] I found with my daughter way more.

[00:24:10] She's probing my defenses.

[00:24:11] Yes.

[00:24:12] All the time.

[00:24:12] All the time.

[00:24:13] Just to see what happens.

[00:24:15] Yeah.

[00:24:16] Often as a day, I'm like, I don't have the energy to defend this.

[00:24:20] No.

[00:24:21] I can't.

[00:24:21] I actually, this requires constant effort to defend against these like little forays

[00:24:28] into seeing what I might and might not respond to.

[00:24:31] Yeah.

[00:24:31] And she's got boundless energy and time.

[00:24:33] And that's the other thing.

[00:24:34] When I talk about my daughter being a great negotiator, she just innately understands.

[00:24:37] Yeah.

[00:24:38] You must move on.

[00:24:39] You will have to at some point.

[00:24:41] And she.

[00:24:42] She's got nothing else to do.

[00:24:43] She doesn't have to.

[00:24:43] Yeah.

[00:24:43] She's got like ultimate leverage.

[00:24:45] Yeah.

[00:24:45] Because she's like.

[00:24:46] My daughter took me an amazing.

[00:24:48] Like I'm 42.

[00:24:49] I have trouble saying no still to people.

[00:24:52] Like someone will ask to something like, oh, I better do that.

[00:24:54] They asked.

[00:24:54] Yeah.

[00:24:55] Even just this morning, I'm like, Rude, come on, brush your hair and eat your breakfast

[00:25:00] or whatever.

[00:25:01] Yeah.

[00:25:01] And she just looked at me.

[00:25:02] She's like, I'm not going to be doing that.

[00:25:04] Oh, man.

[00:25:05] And I was like, this is incredible.

[00:25:06] That is incredible.

[00:25:06] I can't say no to people.

[00:25:08] And you are very good at it.

[00:25:10] Really good at it.

[00:25:11] Well, I'm in trouble.

[00:25:12] Yeah.

[00:25:13] I was like, I won't be doing that.

[00:25:14] And some of the, like that, the way that Rude likes you to look at me like, no, that's

[00:25:18] not happening.

[00:25:20] Like she's just really good at usurping the power dynamic.

[00:25:23] Yeah.

[00:25:23] To, to, just to get you off balance a little bit.

[00:25:25] I think just.

[00:25:26] Did she try that on with, with Zoe?

[00:25:28] No, I think Zoe's probably a bit better at holding the line.

[00:25:31] See, she knows that too, probably.

[00:25:33] Rude knows she can knock me off balance.

[00:25:34] She has this way of looking at me like I'm the new kid to the team.

[00:25:38] And I've like dared speak up in a meeting about like, Hey, uh, what, I don't know.

[00:25:43] Like I'm in like a police department or something.

[00:25:45] She's like, Oh God, the rookie's talking and she's like the 25 year detective.

[00:25:49] That's amazing.

[00:25:50] Yeah.

[00:25:50] You know, I was here before you, you know that, don't you?

[00:25:52] Like, but she, it's good.

[00:25:53] Knocks me off balance.

[00:25:54] Yeah.

[00:25:55] And it's pretty funny too.

[00:25:56] Like that's, I think there's an enjoyment.

[00:25:57] That is tough too, because I really enjoy it.

[00:25:59] That's the thing.

[00:26:00] I probably accidentally allow it.

[00:26:01] Yes.

[00:26:01] I think there's a real enjoyment.

[00:26:03] My favorite show.

[00:26:03] Yeah.

[00:26:04] Yeah.

[00:26:05] Last night, just last night, Joni was such a good sleeper for so long from like five

[00:26:10] weeks, she would start sleeping through the night and we'd tell other parents that and

[00:26:13] they'd be like, Oh fuck off.

[00:26:15] And she slept really great.

[00:26:16] Really, really great.

[00:26:17] The odd thing.

[00:26:18] And then she's really, really tall and she got out of her cot pretty early.

[00:26:22] And then, so we gave her a mattress, you know, a big kid thing.

[00:26:26] And then from then we're kind of fucked and because she just keep coming out, keep coming

[00:26:30] out.

[00:26:30] And there's one on fire.

[00:26:31] So like it was just roaming.

[00:26:33] Just roaming.

[00:26:34] And we call it, we did this method where we just stand at the, at the door and she'd

[00:26:40] open the door and we just walk her back to the bed and we called it the thousand steps

[00:26:43] of madness because you'd go insane.

[00:26:46] And there was some nights.

[00:26:48] Did that teach her though that anytime she opened the door, you would be there?

[00:26:51] Yeah, but it didn't stop her.

[00:26:53] Like she had nothing else to do.

[00:26:54] No, no, but I'm saying that would be exciting for her.

[00:26:56] It was exciting.

[00:26:57] Oh, we'd take turns like going away from the door or, but, but in the end it was.

[00:27:02] It was a mirror around the corner.

[00:27:04] Yeah.

[00:27:04] Just under the thing, like, like detecting a bomb under the car.

[00:27:07] She, she, we would try and go around the corner into our bedroom and stuff.

[00:27:11] But then in the end it was just easy to be outside the door because we knew she was coming

[00:27:14] and, and some nights would be like 70 times.

[00:27:17] We'd be walking her back to the bed and it'd be like, this is a, what are we doing?

[00:27:21] It's, we'd go insane.

[00:27:22] It was crazy.

[00:27:22] Anyway, we got to Australia, but, but we kind of got over that.

[00:27:25] We got through it.

[00:27:27] She started sleeping well again.

[00:27:28] And we got back here to make season two of our show in October.

[00:27:32] And she, she coming back to Australia, something about it.

[00:27:35] She went, I'm not sleeping through the night anymore ever again.

[00:27:38] And she was waking up through the shoot.

[00:27:40] She was waking up five times a night.

[00:27:43] And it was like, you got to be there at six in the morning.

[00:27:45] Like between the two seasons of our show, it's, it's just, it's not a long, it's like two

[00:27:50] weeks that is that is the story time.

[00:27:52] Um, but, but in real life, you can see that it's 18 months and a toddler because the bags

[00:27:57] under my eyes are like, I've never had more reflector boards in front of me, in front of

[00:28:02] the camera.

[00:28:03] They're just dead people desperately trying to make me look.

[00:28:05] It's shining the sun in your face.

[00:28:07] Yeah, that's right.

[00:28:08] Well, I mean, I was actually, the sleep deprivation is not just a joke, right?

[00:28:12] It's a real thing.

[00:28:12] There's nothing funny about it.

[00:28:13] I was talking to a friend the other day and we were talking about like dad bods.

[00:28:17] And I was like, it's not that guys just have kids and then decide I don't care about physical

[00:28:25] activity anymore.

[00:28:26] No.

[00:28:27] We all know that sleep is the number one indicator of health, right?

[00:28:33] Like, I mean, you're in LA, you'd see very fit people all the time.

[00:28:38] I remember reading an article about Henry Cavill who played Superman.

[00:28:42] Yeah.

[00:28:43] And his trainer was like, first thing is like, we're going to turn you into Superman.

[00:28:46] Superman, if you can't sleep at least 10 hours a night, preferably 12, you can't be Superman.

[00:28:52] So it's like, you can go to the gym all you want, but if you're not sleeping enough, we

[00:28:56] can't build that body, right?

[00:28:57] Oh my God.

[00:28:58] Sleep's everything.

[00:28:58] This makes a lot of sense.

[00:28:59] Sleep's everything.

[00:29:00] Yeah.

[00:29:00] That's where dad bods happen.

[00:29:01] It's not because people are like going to the gym or running or bike riding or whatever.

[00:29:04] It's like, you just lose 50% of your sleep.

[00:29:06] Yeah.

[00:29:07] And there's no regeneration.

[00:29:08] You become a husk of yourself.

[00:29:10] Yeah.

[00:29:11] Yeah.

[00:29:11] That makes a lot of sense to me.

[00:29:12] I don't need to look like amazing.

[00:29:15] I've never looked amazing.

[00:29:16] I just need to look not shit.

[00:29:18] You know, I'm just going for not shit.

[00:29:19] Not like a new actor.

[00:29:20] I don't know.

[00:29:21] I don't know.

[00:29:21] I'm using the same body.

[00:29:22] Why'd they replace him?

[00:29:23] I thought he was really good in season one.

[00:29:25] It was fine.

[00:29:26] This new guy, I mean, he does a great impersonation.

[00:29:28] He's nailed the voice, but they get this clearly different guy.

[00:29:31] They bring his dad in.

[00:29:34] Speaking of dads.

[00:29:35] Yes.

[00:29:35] Speaking of dads.

[00:29:37] Your dad.

[00:29:38] Yeah.

[00:29:38] How much of what you're doing now did you take from your dad?

[00:29:41] How much are you going to try and rewrite some of the playbook?

[00:29:45] My dad, and this is a very common story, I think,

[00:29:49] in listening to your guys' podcasts as well.

[00:29:51] It's like, he's an old school dad.

[00:29:52] And this is kind of, it seems to me, a part of the origin point of this.

[00:29:55] It's like, you feel like we're making it up now.

[00:29:57] Because that book of knowledge wasn't really passed down

[00:30:01] because it didn't really exist.

[00:30:02] My dad, he's 85 now.

[00:30:05] Yeah, right.

[00:30:05] So he was late too.

[00:30:07] He was late.

[00:30:08] He's the eldest of seven, eight kids actually.

[00:30:10] He was born in like 39.

[00:30:14] And so he was a very loving dad,

[00:30:17] but he grew up in a time where it was like the women take care of the kids.

[00:30:22] And he jokingly talks about how it's a point of pride that he never changed a nappy.

[00:30:26] And it's kind of a joke that he makes against himself.

[00:30:28] But that's sort of the world that he became a father in.

[00:30:31] Yeah.

[00:30:32] And being a man at that time and being a dad at that time was, you know,

[00:30:35] being the red winner.

[00:30:39] And, you know, he was doing that.

[00:30:40] He was a journalist and he was working lots of hours and traveling the world

[00:30:43] and that sort of stuff.

[00:30:44] He was really good at it.

[00:30:45] But he was, it was mum who was the primary carer for all of us.

[00:30:50] And nothing against that.

[00:30:51] Like I say, he was a beautiful and is a beautiful man.

[00:30:54] No.

[00:30:54] And that's the funny thing about this area where it's sort of like we know

[00:31:00] there were just guys doing their best.

[00:31:01] Yeah.

[00:31:01] And it's just a very different mindset than we appear to have.

[00:31:06] Yeah.

[00:31:06] Because you think to yourself like, I hope you weren't stifled.

[00:31:09] Like, I mean, I hope you weren't sitting there going,

[00:31:11] I wish I was more involved with the kids.

[00:31:14] It's just.

[00:31:15] I wonder.

[00:31:15] Yeah.

[00:31:16] I've never got that impression from dad.

[00:31:18] Like from my dad.

[00:31:18] I've never had him being like, God damn it,

[00:31:20] I wish I didn't have to work so much and I could be more involved with you guys.

[00:31:22] No.

[00:31:23] And it sounds like your dad might be in a similar boat.

[00:31:25] Just matter of fact, tell me like, oh, it just wasn't the way.

[00:31:28] No.

[00:31:28] This was my role and that was your mum's role.

[00:31:31] And I guess what that leaves us in our generation to be like is like,

[00:31:34] hmm, okay, well, it's not really what I want to do.

[00:31:37] So.

[00:31:37] No.

[00:31:38] I guess now we figure out a new way.

[00:31:40] Yeah.

[00:31:41] We figure it out through podcasts mainly.

[00:31:44] Mainly through podcasts.

[00:31:45] Yeah, mainly from podcasts.

[00:31:45] Either hosting them, being on them or listening to them,

[00:31:47] all three work.

[00:31:48] All three.

[00:31:49] So yeah, thank God for podcasts.

[00:31:51] Yeah.

[00:31:51] But I think there is something I do get from him,

[00:31:53] which is a really practical sense.

[00:31:55] I do have a, there's a, yeah, a practical approach to parenting.

[00:32:00] It's, I don't tend to get caught up in, in, in,

[00:32:05] I don't think too much.

[00:32:06] Actually, that's not true.

[00:32:07] I think about it all the time, but, but I,

[00:32:09] I think it's pretty simple.

[00:32:11] Not the doing of it, but the basic foundation.

[00:32:13] Or the ability to just, if it's getting too much,

[00:32:15] to fall back to some fundamentals to go.

[00:32:17] Yeah.

[00:32:17] Let's do the basics.

[00:32:18] Yeah, I think so.

[00:32:19] I don't think it's a, I think you can overthink it.

[00:32:24] That doesn't stop me from overthinking it,

[00:32:25] but I think I know on some level that it's a, it's a,

[00:32:27] it's a pragmatic thing to do.

[00:32:30] Yeah.

[00:32:31] That's, yeah, that's, yeah,

[00:32:33] that'd kind of be the main thing I think I get from him.

[00:32:35] What, what scares you about being a dad?

[00:32:40] Probably being an old dad and dying early.

[00:32:44] If I'm being honest,

[00:32:45] I've never really thought about it because I'm so in the trenches with it at

[00:32:49] the moment.

[00:32:49] I don't think about it.

[00:32:51] But that would be the thing that I'm not there later.

[00:32:55] And I think, I think about,

[00:32:58] about Harry being there when I'm not there and that'll happen,

[00:33:02] you know, probably if,

[00:33:03] if all the natural order of things,

[00:33:05] takes its course,

[00:33:07] that would probably be an existential thing,

[00:33:10] a big thing that I don't really think about.

[00:33:12] And I've never thought about what scares me about being a dad.

[00:33:15] That's how sort of in the middle of it I am,

[00:33:17] but just fucking up really.

[00:33:19] But I, but also I think I've also resigned myself to the idea that I will

[00:33:23] fuck it up a lot.

[00:33:26] And I just hope that I don't fuck it up too much.

[00:33:28] You know,

[00:33:29] I'm still actually very hopeful that I'll do enough so that Joni will be equipped

[00:33:37] for the world.

[00:33:39] Yeah.

[00:33:39] A dear friend of mine.

[00:33:40] I mean,

[00:33:41] that is all we want,

[00:33:42] isn't it?

[00:33:42] That's it.

[00:33:42] A dear friend of mine has got two boys and she's raising both teenagers.

[00:33:46] And she,

[00:33:46] she told me years ago,

[00:33:47] she said,

[00:33:47] she thinks the job of a parent is to make kids who are interested and interesting.

[00:33:53] And I thought,

[00:33:53] Oh,

[00:33:54] that's perfect.

[00:33:54] That's brilliant.

[00:33:55] Yeah.

[00:33:55] I just need my,

[00:33:56] my job is to equip them for the world.

[00:34:00] I think that's what we're all trying to do.

[00:34:01] We've all just got different points of view on how to do that.

[00:34:04] Totally.

[00:34:05] It's not about knowing how to do it either.

[00:34:06] It's about engagement or modeling,

[00:34:09] you know,

[00:34:09] all those kinds of same things.

[00:34:11] It's about being the person,

[00:34:13] being the best person I can be doing it,

[00:34:15] do it.

[00:34:15] Yeah.

[00:34:16] Doing it every day so that she can see it as well.

[00:34:19] And that means seeing all the flaws and all the weaknesses and all that sort of shit.

[00:34:21] As long as I'm honest about it.

[00:34:23] I sometimes find that's a whole order to think about for my kids.

[00:34:26] I'm like,

[00:34:26] I found them incredibly forgiving already.

[00:34:29] Oh really?

[00:34:29] Even at,

[00:34:30] at pre 10 years old,

[00:34:33] cause we do have a lot of conversations where I'm like,

[00:34:35] I didn't get this right.

[00:34:37] And I reckon I,

[00:34:38] I reckon,

[00:34:39] Hey,

[00:34:39] before I think that was the wrong thing to do.

[00:34:41] I,

[00:34:41] I approached that the wrong way.

[00:34:43] Yeah.

[00:34:44] And I've,

[00:34:45] I'm amazed how,

[00:34:46] when you have those conversations with a kid,

[00:34:49] they're really forgiving.

[00:34:51] With your kids.

[00:34:51] You have those conversations.

[00:34:52] Yeah.

[00:34:53] Yeah.

[00:34:54] What was on that?

[00:34:54] There was one that happened the other day.

[00:34:55] Oh yeah.

[00:34:56] I mean,

[00:34:56] fuck the kids were squabbling and that's going to happen.

[00:34:59] Like six and nine there.

[00:35:00] Yeah.

[00:35:00] Yeah.

[00:35:02] And yeah,

[00:35:02] this kind of comes back to screen time.

[00:35:04] I never,

[00:35:04] like I'm just,

[00:35:05] this was a real,

[00:35:06] this was a real sloppy moment for me.

[00:35:08] But again,

[00:35:09] one of those ones where it kind of comes out of your mouth and you're like,

[00:35:11] that was bad.

[00:35:13] But there was squabbling about something and I,

[00:35:14] and it sounded like,

[00:35:16] it felt like something that was like threatening Rudy,

[00:35:18] not physically,

[00:35:19] but like,

[00:35:20] you know,

[00:35:20] old dudes,

[00:35:20] I don't know,

[00:35:21] take this from your room or,

[00:35:22] you know,

[00:35:23] it was just territorial.

[00:35:24] Like a lot of stuff's like rooms and possession stuff.

[00:35:26] Fortunately,

[00:35:27] territory goes away as an adult.

[00:35:28] You don't,

[00:35:29] you stop worrying about territorial.

[00:35:30] No,

[00:35:31] where you go.

[00:35:31] No,

[00:35:31] no.

[00:35:32] That's not a problem in the world.

[00:35:33] It's fine.

[00:35:33] Sharing's easy.

[00:35:34] So it was like,

[00:35:34] he'd threatened something.

[00:35:36] Right.

[00:35:36] Yeah.

[00:35:36] And I was like,

[00:35:37] if you do that,

[00:35:38] if you,

[00:35:40] I mean it,

[00:35:40] like if you follow through,

[00:35:41] it was like a weekend.

[00:35:41] I was like,

[00:35:42] that's it.

[00:35:42] There'll be no,

[00:35:44] you know,

[00:35:44] real basic.

[00:35:46] Yeah.

[00:35:46] There'll be no screen time or something.

[00:35:47] So real basic doesn't work.

[00:35:50] I'm not,

[00:35:50] it's not something I endorse.

[00:35:52] Punishments just don't work,

[00:35:54] but in my books,

[00:35:55] but I still did it.

[00:35:57] Anyway,

[00:35:57] everyone kind of went away.

[00:35:58] He was like really upset.

[00:35:59] I think.

[00:36:01] You followed through.

[00:36:02] You made the threat.

[00:36:02] No,

[00:36:03] I made the threat.

[00:36:03] Right.

[00:36:03] Right.

[00:36:04] So he went away.

[00:36:05] I went away.

[00:36:05] I was like,

[00:36:06] that felt bad.

[00:36:07] We all sort of cooled down.

[00:36:08] And I went back and I was like,

[00:36:10] Hey,

[00:36:11] you know,

[00:36:11] can I talk to you for a bit?

[00:36:12] I said,

[00:36:13] I don't think that,

[00:36:14] I don't think that was great before.

[00:36:15] I want to apologize.

[00:36:16] I don't think I handled that very well.

[00:36:17] I said,

[00:36:18] I probably came in late there and I didn't really understand what was going on.

[00:36:22] Like help me understand what was going on a bit more because I believe you,

[00:36:26] I believe Rue,

[00:36:27] we got to figure it all out together.

[00:36:28] And then suddenly he goes,

[00:36:29] he goes,

[00:36:30] you know,

[00:36:30] I did think it was sort of weird that you were angry at me for threatening

[00:36:33] Rudy.

[00:36:34] And then you just threatened to take away my screen time.

[00:36:36] Oh boy.

[00:36:36] I was like,

[00:36:38] that's very wise.

[00:36:39] Shit.

[00:36:40] I was like,

[00:36:41] that's very true.

[00:36:42] I said,

[00:36:43] I just turned around and I threatened you straight away.

[00:36:46] Oh my God.

[00:36:46] I was like,

[00:36:47] good ones.

[00:36:48] I mean,

[00:36:48] how dare he knows that and see that.

[00:36:51] I said,

[00:36:52] and that just goes to show I'm,

[00:36:53] I'm just as guilty as anyone else.

[00:36:57] That's amazing that you,

[00:36:58] that you cop to that stuff.

[00:37:00] Oh,

[00:37:01] all the time.

[00:37:01] I think I will do the same.

[00:37:02] I'd like to think so.

[00:37:03] No,

[00:37:03] really.

[00:37:04] I've found it to be pretty easy once you start it.

[00:37:08] And especially if you,

[00:37:09] become quite addictive.

[00:37:11] Yeah.

[00:37:11] Hey mate,

[00:37:12] just want to say sorry before for like when I set the table,

[00:37:15] I think the knife was a bit off.

[00:37:16] I'm sorry dude.

[00:37:16] Yeah,

[00:37:16] it was a bit off.

[00:37:17] Dad.

[00:37:17] Your salad fork should be on that side.

[00:37:19] Oh,

[00:37:19] I'm not going to do it again.

[00:37:20] I'm sorry.

[00:37:20] But I think if,

[00:37:21] you know,

[00:37:22] I always sort of want to model to them,

[00:37:24] the goal there is to go like,

[00:37:25] hey,

[00:37:25] after a blow up,

[00:37:27] it's,

[00:37:27] yeah,

[00:37:27] if you can,

[00:37:29] if you really feel that you handled something poorly,

[00:37:31] like say it sooner rather than later.

[00:37:33] Yeah.

[00:37:33] And,

[00:37:34] but it's so often,

[00:37:35] like so often I'm amazed that kids will turn around and be like,

[00:37:38] it's,

[00:37:39] like an instant.

[00:37:40] They're so quick to forgive.

[00:37:41] Instant for.

[00:37:42] Yeah.

[00:37:43] Yeah.

[00:37:45] Joni has started recently saying,

[00:37:46] sorry,

[00:37:46] daddy at stuff.

[00:37:48] And sometimes it doesn't make any sense because it's like,

[00:37:50] it doesn't,

[00:37:51] like it doesn't even make contextual sense,

[00:37:52] but other times she says it and it's heartbreaking.

[00:37:56] And,

[00:37:57] and every now and then she'll say it when I have done something shit or,

[00:38:01] or I've gone,

[00:38:02] Joni or yelled or something,

[00:38:03] you know,

[00:38:06] where's that music?

[00:38:07] Let's just enjoy this.

[00:38:10] Guys,

[00:38:11] this is leave it,

[00:38:11] leave it.

[00:38:12] We can't afford it.

[00:38:13] We can't afford it.

[00:38:14] You know,

[00:38:14] I told you this was our apartment.

[00:38:16] I think the owner's coming home and they just started playing music.

[00:38:20] What's connected to the Bluetooth?

[00:38:21] Well,

[00:38:21] what do you use Apple want?

[00:38:23] At least it's not porn sounds,

[00:38:24] you know?

[00:38:26] Wow.

[00:38:26] That was really a,

[00:38:27] well,

[00:38:27] at first I was like,

[00:38:29] oh,

[00:38:29] there's,

[00:38:30] they are,

[00:38:30] they're,

[00:38:30] they're thin walls here.

[00:38:31] I think someone started playing guitar next door.

[00:38:33] I thought that you've added a musical guest to the podcast.

[00:38:36] Okay.

[00:38:36] Well,

[00:38:37] thanks very much,

[00:38:38] man.

[00:38:38] That's all we've got time for.

[00:38:40] Did you hear what Tim immediately yelled out?

[00:38:42] What?

[00:38:43] We can't afford this.

[00:38:45] That's a TV producer's head right there straight away.

[00:38:48] He's like,

[00:38:49] don't make gags.

[00:38:50] We have to cut all this shit out.

[00:38:51] We don't have the rights.

[00:38:52] We don't have the rights.

[00:38:53] That's so good.

[00:38:57] Oh boy.

[00:38:58] Sorry.

[00:38:58] You were saying that she started saying sorry,

[00:39:00] daddy,

[00:39:00] like to,

[00:39:00] to,

[00:39:01] to,

[00:39:01] yes.

[00:39:02] Yeah.

[00:39:02] She started saying,

[00:39:03] sorry.

[00:39:04] And yeah,

[00:39:06] occasionally,

[00:39:06] well,

[00:39:07] a couple of times,

[00:39:08] you know,

[00:39:09] I've,

[00:39:09] I've said something I've yelled or I've done,

[00:39:11] you know,

[00:39:11] so I've been stern or something.

[00:39:13] She's gone,

[00:39:13] sorry,

[00:39:14] daddy,

[00:39:15] because,

[00:39:15] because it's in response to something she's done.

[00:39:17] Um,

[00:39:18] and it's,

[00:39:19] uh,

[00:39:21] incredible.

[00:39:22] First,

[00:39:22] it's incredibly,

[00:39:24] I feel terrible immediately.

[00:39:25] You know,

[00:39:25] I feel incredibly,

[00:39:27] I don't have humbled to the right word,

[00:39:28] but I just feel,

[00:39:28] oh,

[00:39:28] she should never be apologizing.

[00:39:30] It's that you've got this tiny little person and you're big.

[00:39:33] Yes.

[00:39:34] Yeah.

[00:39:34] She shouldn't be apologizing to me.

[00:39:36] Um,

[00:39:36] but the second thing notice about it is,

[00:39:38] is how quickly she forgives me for anything.

[00:39:42] Yeah.

[00:39:43] It's really,

[00:39:44] uh,

[00:39:45] amazing.

[00:39:45] Like,

[00:39:46] I think we obviously,

[00:39:48] I mean,

[00:39:48] this is just allow me to just quickly give myself a degree.

[00:39:52] Go on.

[00:39:52] Evolutionary psychology.

[00:39:53] Oh,

[00:39:54] fantastic.

[00:39:54] But we,

[00:39:56] of like to the,

[00:39:57] to our parents,

[00:39:58] to our,

[00:39:59] like we need our parents love and protection.

[00:40:02] Yeah.

[00:40:02] Always.

[00:40:03] It would be,

[00:40:04] it's completely in us to forgive as much as possible.

[00:40:07] Now I know once we get to be adults,

[00:40:08] we have a lot of therapists do a lot of good work and make a lot of money.

[00:40:13] Yeah.

[00:40:13] With us dealing with our parents stuff.

[00:40:15] But when you're a little kid,

[00:40:17] I need you.

[00:40:18] I'm not going to hold a grudge.

[00:40:19] Also,

[00:40:19] there's no ego there yet.

[00:40:20] You know,

[00:40:21] so that it doesn't cost them in the same way to apologize.

[00:40:24] Probably.

[00:40:25] Yeah.

[00:40:25] They'll say whatever they need to say to,

[00:40:27] but you're right.

[00:40:27] It's such a precious thing and you can't,

[00:40:29] it's super precious.

[00:40:30] Yeah.

[00:40:31] You can't fuck with it.

[00:40:32] Yeah.

[00:40:32] Yeah.

[00:40:34] Does it change how you are on screen?

[00:40:37] Does it change how you play characters and stuff now that you have a bit,

[00:40:42] you have another emotional side to draw on?

[00:40:45] I don't think,

[00:40:47] actually maybe.

[00:40:48] Yeah.

[00:40:48] Yeah.

[00:40:49] Maybe I do have more emotional stuff there to draw from.

[00:40:53] I don't think since she's been alive,

[00:40:55] I've had the big,

[00:40:56] actually that's not true.

[00:40:57] That's not true at all.

[00:40:58] Yeah.

[00:40:59] It absolutely provides more stuff to draw on for emotional material.

[00:41:05] But I think the bigger change is that I'm less focused.

[00:41:10] I think it makes me again,

[00:41:12] prioritize my career,

[00:41:15] my professional involvement.

[00:41:17] You know,

[00:41:17] it's,

[00:41:17] I used to,

[00:41:18] I could spend 24 hours a day,

[00:41:21] you know,

[00:41:21] on an acting thing or a,

[00:41:24] whereas now I don't have the,

[00:41:25] I don't have the time for that.

[00:41:26] I don't have the,

[00:41:27] yeah,

[00:41:28] that's interesting.

[00:41:29] I love being in the middle of the creative process,

[00:41:31] but that's not necessarily acting anymore.

[00:41:33] I don't know if that's something that would have happened anyway,

[00:41:35] or,

[00:41:36] or that's something that has happened since.

[00:41:38] So it's more the fact that what you were talking about earlier,

[00:41:40] which was,

[00:41:41] you know,

[00:41:42] pre kids,

[00:41:42] you're like,

[00:41:43] my time is my time.

[00:41:44] And now post kids are like a little bit of my time.

[00:41:46] That's right.

[00:41:47] And I've just got other things.

[00:41:49] That's right.

[00:41:49] Well,

[00:41:50] all of my time that's for me is borrowed time.

[00:41:52] All the time I have that I'm not with Joni.

[00:41:54] That's how you see it.

[00:41:56] That's how it feels.

[00:41:57] Yeah.

[00:41:57] Yeah.

[00:41:57] I don't,

[00:41:58] I don't have a,

[00:41:58] it's not a choice.

[00:41:59] It feels like I'll,

[00:42:01] it's like stretching a rubber band.

[00:42:02] I'll always have to come back to Joni forever now.

[00:42:06] And that's not a bad thing.

[00:42:07] I'm happy about it.

[00:42:08] I love it,

[00:42:08] but it's just a completely different kind of existence.

[00:42:11] And I think that filters into my work as well,

[00:42:13] into my career.

[00:42:14] So,

[00:42:14] but when I'm there,

[00:42:16] when I can be doing the creative thing or the work,

[00:42:20] I'll a hundred percent be there,

[00:42:21] but I know I can't live there.

[00:42:24] I'll have to live over here now.

[00:42:26] That's a,

[00:42:26] that's a really interesting way of putting it.

[00:42:28] Yeah.

[00:42:29] Yeah.

[00:42:29] I love that.

[00:42:30] I know we've got,

[00:42:31] we've got to eat in a moment.

[00:42:33] Do we?

[00:42:34] Haven't we been talking for like eight minutes?

[00:42:36] Yeah,

[00:42:36] no,

[00:42:36] it does go quick.

[00:42:36] Okay,

[00:42:37] it really has.

[00:42:38] Gold standard.

[00:42:39] Do you have something in your life that's like a,

[00:42:41] a gold standard example of?

[00:42:45] Yeah,

[00:42:45] I thought about,

[00:42:46] I've thought about this a bit.

[00:42:47] And I think probably the one that sticks out to me is my,

[00:42:52] my brother.

[00:42:53] I have an older brother.

[00:42:53] He's seven years older than me.

[00:42:55] And he,

[00:42:56] he has four kids.

[00:42:58] Two of them are from his first marriage and they're 20 and 23 now.

[00:43:02] And he's got two little girls in his second marriage.

[00:43:05] And the two from his first marriage,

[00:43:08] he,

[00:43:09] because that,

[00:43:10] that marriage broke down and stuff,

[00:43:11] you know,

[00:43:11] they had,

[00:43:12] they had,

[00:43:12] he didn't see them as much and they were with their mother.

[00:43:14] They lived with their mom for a long time and he saw them occasionally,

[00:43:17] but it was,

[00:43:17] you know,

[00:43:18] it was,

[00:43:19] yeah,

[00:43:19] it was an arrested kind of growth with those guys.

[00:43:22] And they're both on the spectrum as well.

[00:43:23] And they're high functioning,

[00:43:24] but they're,

[00:43:25] they wanted to try and move out and do some stuff and try and,

[00:43:28] you know,

[00:43:28] come into the world a bit.

[00:43:29] And he's got,

[00:43:30] he's got this property just outside of Canberra.

[00:43:33] And he has this sort of granny flat thing out the front and he converted it so

[00:43:37] that they could come and stay with them.

[00:43:39] And he and his wife,

[00:43:41] my sister-in-law have just,

[00:43:44] because they're family,

[00:43:44] of course,

[00:43:45] but,

[00:43:45] but he's just gone,

[00:43:46] yep,

[00:43:46] come and live with us.

[00:43:47] And it's,

[00:43:48] he's just embracing the circus really.

[00:43:51] And just going,

[00:43:52] I know they need this.

[00:43:53] And it's,

[00:43:53] you know,

[00:43:54] it's late in the day,

[00:43:55] they're 20 something,

[00:43:56] you know,

[00:43:56] in terms of parenting,

[00:43:57] but he's,

[00:43:59] he's just absolutely absorbed them into his everyday,

[00:44:02] which is something that,

[00:44:04] of course,

[00:44:04] he's their dad.

[00:44:05] Of course he should do that.

[00:44:06] But I don't think he's really thought twice about if he's honest with himself.

[00:44:10] But you look at that and go,

[00:44:12] I look at that and I go,

[00:44:13] well,

[00:44:13] that's right.

[00:44:14] He's,

[00:44:14] he's absolutely prioritized their growth and their need.

[00:44:17] And,

[00:44:18] and it's a,

[00:44:18] it's an everyday grind,

[00:44:20] you know,

[00:44:20] the adults living with them.

[00:44:22] Yeah.

[00:44:23] It's a very good word to use,

[00:44:25] isn't it?

[00:44:25] Prioritize because I reckon that is quite a common thread between these gold

[00:44:32] standard daddy examples that people come up with.

[00:44:34] I reckon the reason it resonates with us,

[00:44:36] because we're like,

[00:44:37] that is,

[00:44:39] that's kind of the dad we all aspire to be.

[00:44:41] Yeah.

[00:44:41] Sometimes life gets in the way,

[00:44:42] our selfishness,

[00:44:43] our busyness,

[00:44:43] we know those things we're less proud of getting away.

[00:44:46] But when you're at its most pure and when you get the most joy out of it is

[00:44:51] when you're able to prioritize your kids.

[00:44:53] Totally.

[00:44:54] Harren,

[00:44:54] I said from early days of journey,

[00:44:56] it's like parenting is actually pretty easy until you try and do anything else

[00:45:00] at any moment.

[00:45:01] It's easy.

[00:45:02] Yeah.

[00:45:03] I'm sure that even stops being true after a while.

[00:45:05] Like they even just parenting,

[00:45:06] even if you're there 24 seven,

[00:45:07] it starts being hard anyway.

[00:45:08] But,

[00:45:08] but it's like just trying to live your own life.

[00:45:10] And I still,

[00:45:11] I don't think it's really important.

[00:45:12] Because then the trade-offs come in.

[00:45:13] The trade-offs and you've got to prioritize and balance shit.

[00:45:15] And,

[00:45:16] and also you,

[00:45:17] you do have to understand it's important for your kid to see you functioning in

[00:45:20] the world as a citizen,

[00:45:22] as a working person.

[00:45:23] Totally.

[00:45:23] Um,

[00:45:24] so all those things do matter.

[00:45:25] You can't just,

[00:45:27] I mean,

[00:45:28] perhaps some people can.

[00:45:29] No,

[00:45:29] and there wouldn't have much to,

[00:45:31] it would be a weird existence if you just sat there with your head in your palms,

[00:45:35] staring at them,

[00:45:35] smiling,

[00:45:36] going,

[00:45:36] what can I do for you next?

[00:45:37] That'd be weird.

[00:45:38] That'd be weird for me.

[00:45:38] That'd be weird.

[00:45:39] Yeah.

[00:45:39] But that's the thing.

[00:45:40] And,

[00:45:41] but we know in our hearts,

[00:45:42] it's like,

[00:45:42] well,

[00:45:42] when we see someone like your brother going,

[00:45:45] even with all that,

[00:45:46] yeah,

[00:45:46] you know that with that prioritization has come untold sacrifice.

[00:45:51] Yes.

[00:45:51] You're like,

[00:45:52] that's,

[00:45:52] yeah,

[00:45:52] that's right.

[00:45:53] That's right.

[00:45:54] Yeah,

[00:45:54] it really is.

[00:45:55] Um,

[00:45:55] and that's,

[00:45:56] yeah,

[00:45:56] and the gold,

[00:45:57] the gold standard can be such a small thing and such a big thing.

[00:46:00] And it is,

[00:46:01] but it's a daily thing as well.

[00:46:03] You know,

[00:46:03] I think that's the really hard thing to communicate with,

[00:46:05] but that's what we all admire the most is,

[00:46:07] is rather than,

[00:46:08] you know,

[00:46:08] yeah,

[00:46:09] that's not just a big gesture.

[00:46:10] That's a big thing made up of millions.

[00:46:12] Yeah,

[00:46:12] that's the difference.

[00:46:12] It's not a gesture.

[00:46:14] Yeah.

[00:46:14] It's not a gesture.

[00:46:15] And I think that's the,

[00:46:16] when gold standards make themselves obvious,

[00:46:18] there's no gesture about it.

[00:46:20] It's a real thing that requires priority and requires sacrifice and focus.

[00:46:26] As you said.

[00:46:27] And empathy and,

[00:46:27] you know,

[00:46:28] yeah.

[00:46:28] Love in action.

[00:46:30] Yeah.

[00:46:30] Yeah.

[00:46:30] Love in action.

[00:46:31] Beautiful.

[00:46:32] Mate,

[00:46:32] Paddy,

[00:46:32] thank you so much for joining us.

[00:46:34] I mean,

[00:46:35] we'll never,

[00:46:35] I don't know if we'll be able to air the music that played in between,

[00:46:38] but God,

[00:46:39] if we could afford,

[00:46:39] if we've paid for the song,

[00:46:40] we just use it as the play out music now.

[00:46:42] That'd be actually brilliant.

[00:46:44] I'm sure you guys can afford it.

[00:46:45] Can we pay for that song?

[00:46:46] Come with me.

[00:46:46] A hundred percent not.

[00:46:48] Okay.

[00:46:48] Okay.

[00:46:49] All right.

[00:46:49] Well,

[00:46:49] here's,

[00:46:50] here's me playing some acoustic guitar.

[00:46:51] Fantastic.

[00:46:53] Thank you so much.

[00:46:54] Thanks,

[00:46:54] mate.

[00:46:55] Hamish is glad that he talked to another dad.

[00:46:58] Now he's going to say some other stuff,

[00:47:00] but he will be by himself.

[00:47:03] So good.

[00:47:04] So good.

[00:47:05] Thank you so much,

[00:47:05] Paddy.

[00:47:06] A real,

[00:47:07] a massive treat to get his thoughts and to sit there.

[00:47:12] And,

[00:47:12] and you know,

[00:47:12] I just said,

[00:47:13] they're grinning a lot of the time listening to Patrick,

[00:47:14] because he just has such a great way of,

[00:47:17] of putting things.

[00:47:18] I also really like and have stolen.

[00:47:21] Um,

[00:47:21] I now realized many times after the,

[00:47:23] after the chat,

[00:47:24] him saying that parenting is really easy until you have to do something else.

[00:47:27] And man,

[00:47:29] that is,

[00:47:30] that is extremely true.

[00:47:31] Also special shout out to,

[00:47:33] that is a real,

[00:47:34] that's one of the great gold standard daddings.

[00:47:36] I reckon we've ever had beautiful chat.

[00:47:37] Uh,

[00:47:37] thank you so much,

[00:47:38] Patrick.

[00:47:38] Like he is an incredibly busy person and for him to come and hang out with us,

[00:47:42] really appreciated it.

[00:47:44] Small note.

[00:47:45] I suppose the fact that that music stayed in the podcast,

[00:47:50] I'm surprised it did when the music started playing accidentally through the Bluetooth speaker,

[00:47:54] that either means Tim has missed it in the edit or he somehow thinks that,

[00:47:59] um,

[00:48:00] yeah,

[00:48:00] we might've,

[00:48:00] we might've bought the copyright.

[00:48:02] So thanks to her.

[00:48:03] It's probably,

[00:48:03] because if we have bought it,

[00:48:04] they've paid for it.

[00:48:05] So either way,

[00:48:06] glad it stayed in.

[00:48:06] And really glad that you joined us for this one.

[00:48:09] We'll see you next week.

[00:48:11] How are the dad's dad?

[00:48:14] How are the dad's dad?

[00:48:17] How are the dad's dad is produced by myself and my mate,

[00:48:21] Tim Bartley.

[00:48:22] The theme song is thanks to the incredibly talented Tom Carty.

[00:48:27] You can find him drenched throughout the internet.

[00:48:30] We recorded this particular episode on the lands of the Guttigal people of the Euro nation,

[00:48:34] and we pay our respect to their culture of storytelling.

[00:48:36] That has survived for thousands of years.

[00:48:39] If you want to say hi,

[00:48:40] head to our website,

[00:48:41] how are the dad's dad?

[00:48:42] Dot com.

[00:48:43] But most of all,

[00:48:44] thank you for listening.

[00:48:45] Hamish is a dad who just spoke with a dad.

[00:48:48] And it blew his tiny mind about what he learned.

[00:48:51] So he'll keep on the dads and forcing them to talk to him.

[00:48:54] So he can find other dad's dad.

[00:49:00] Before we go,

[00:49:01] the organisers of how are the dad's dad?

[00:49:05] Didn't even say producers.

[00:49:07] No,

[00:49:07] we produced it.

[00:49:08] Look,

[00:49:09] both of us would like to thank Hertz again.

[00:49:12] Hertz,

[00:49:12] always there for us whenever we need a car,

[00:49:14] whenever you need a car to rent.

[00:49:17] We'd love you to think about Hertz.

[00:49:18] You can get 25% off by going to hertz.com.au forward slash H O D D as in how are the dad's dad.

[00:49:25] You get 25% off the base day rate.

[00:49:27] Terms and conditions do apply to that.

[00:49:29] And yeah,

[00:49:30] this is the same.

[00:49:31] We do the same ad recording at the end of every episode.

[00:49:34] That is true.

[00:49:35] But the reason we do that is because we think it's a great analogy to how consistent service you get at Hertz is.

[00:49:43] So we're like,

[00:49:43] let's do the same ad to represent the same consistent quality episode to episode car to car at Hertz.

[00:49:50] Not just because we're looking to save time.

[00:49:52] Absolutely not.

[00:49:53] Couldn't.

[00:49:53] Why would you ever think that?

[00:49:54] Thanks Hertz.